Nicole Vienneau  00:00

Welcome, everyone, to the Integrative Nurse Coaches in ACTION! podcast. My name is Nicole Vienneau. I am your host, and I'm also a board certified integrative Nurse coach, and today is an exciting day. I have the pleasure of talking all about lifestyle Nursing. 

And lifestyle Nursing is a big component for all of us listeners here, for Nurses across the board, and we have an expert in our midst today. Her name is Dr. Karen Laing. She is the creator of the Lifestyle Nursing specialty program, which is brand new, and to be specific, it's called Lifestyle Nursing: A Lifestyle Medicine Framework for Nurses. It sounds like this is going to be a great conversation, and so let's welcome Karen.

Karen Laing  00:57

Oh, thank you so much, Nicole. I'm super excited to talk to you and your audience today.

Nicole Vienneau  01:03

Well, we are excited too, because all things connected to holistic Nursing and how we can really support our patients and ourselves along our journey are what we want to talk about here. So Karen, we love to take a step down history lane. You know, we love to talk about how you even decided to become a Nurse, and some of your history related to Nursing.

Karen Laing  01:25

All right, so back in the day, actually, there are some pictures of me as a child, dressed in Nursing gear. So I think, think my parents kind of had this out for me. I actually thought that I was going to go to medical school. That was my intention, I wanted to become an OB GYN. 

And then one summer, I took two semesters of organic chemistry, and absolutely hated it. I hated being that immersed. And I thought this is the closest to medical school I ever want to get. And so then I started looking for, well, what am I going to do if I'm not going to go to medical school? And I started looking at Nursing because I actually considered respiratory therapy, but I didn't want to deal with sputum, so I ended up choosing Nursing, which, you know, then I got to deal with every bodily fluid, right? 

But I chose it because I knew there were so many opportunities in Nursing. I could go into education, I could go into sales, I could be a bedside Nurse, I could be an office Nurse, I could work in the operating room. Wasn't sure what I wanted to do, but that was how I ended up landing on Nursing. I saw it as a lot of opportunities.

Nicole Vienneau  02:39

And it is, oh my gosh. There's so many opportunities and so many directions that you can go in Nursing so, good choice, good choice. Maybe I'm a little biased, though, right?

Karen Laing  02:51

Yes, we might be.

Nicole Vienneau  02:52

I think so. So tell us a little bit about some maybe some specialty areas that you've enjoyed in your career. 

Karen Laing  02:59

Sure. So when I graduated from Nursing school, I still had that passion. I wanted to become that midwife. I was going to become a midwife because I didn't get to become an OB GYN. You know, I chose not to do that. But at the time, I had the opportunity to go into a surgical ICU fellowship program at a level one trauma center in Washington, DC. 

And so I thought, well, I'll do this for a while, and then I'll go back and I'll become that midwife that I intend to become. But you know how our paths always end up kind of doing this thing that we never expect. And while I was in that fellowship program and in the years after that, I fell in love with the cardiac patients. 

And so because it was SICU I was dealing with cardiac surgery patients, and I kept thinking, wouldn't it be good if we could get a hold of these people before they had surgery? And so then I went into cardiac and pulmonary rehab. I did some cardiac wellness. But I kept thinking, you know, they still had to have that diagnosis, right? 

I kept thinking, wouldn't it be good if we get a hold of these people before they had the diagnosis? That would make more sense to me. And there was one gentleman that will always stick out to me, because we worked together for about a year, and he said to me, I feel better now than I did before I had my heart attack, because I've made all those changes I meant to make some day. 

And I thought, how awful is it that somebody's gotta have a heart attack in order to feel better. There's gotta be a better way, right? And so this was quite a while ago, and Nurse coach training was just becoming a thing. So I did personal coach training. I wasn't even aware that Nurse coach training was available, and then started down that path. 

And then we had some kids, and I thought... I had my own business doing coaching... and I thought, you know, I'm not so good at putting those, you know, when you're at working at home, you don't, you know, clock out. And I thought, Okay, I'm going to give this a little rest. So I used those coaching skills and worked PRN in cardiac and pulmonary rehab for a period of time, and then continued to do that— cardiac wellness. 

I did a bunch of different things— coronary artery calcium scoring callbacks. I did virtual cardiac rehab. I've just done a lot of different things in that kind of area. We did community education and screenings, things like that. And then in 2017 I rebirthed my coaching business, and when I did that, I saw, Wow, there are a whole lot more health and wellness coaches than there were back in the day when I first started this. 

And that was when I decided that I needed something that made me stand out from the others, that showed my value. And so I did all the things that I needed to do to be eligible to sit for the Nurse coach certification exam, which I did and passed. And so then I was able to take that into my coaching clients, and kind of set myself apart. 

I don't know how far you want me to go on my journey here. So you know I did that... before that I had actually looked at... for Nursing, I was looking for something that was a good fit for me, and I couldn't really find anything in Nursing. There used to be a holistic Nurse practitioner program in New York, and my understanding is something happened with licensing, or something with that. 

People were having difficulty in other states, and so I just couldn't find anything I wanted to do that was a good fit for me. And so I got a master's in health promotion management from Marymount University in Arlington, Virginia, and I became a certified health education specialist as well. So then when I... after, I guess, we moved. I lived near Tampa, Florida. 

When we moved to Tampa, I started looking for some people that might be, you know, similarly minded to me. I was working remotely for a hospital system in Richmond, Virginia, and having had my own business as well. And so I found the Tampa Chapter of the American Holistic Nurses Association, and so then I became a certified holistic Nurse, and then became a certified Nurse coach. So I have the pleasure of the health and wellness Nurse coach title board certified. 

Nicole Vienneau  07:54

Yay! Such a wide range of experience that you have, from starting, you know, thinking you want to be one thing, and then realizing, Oh, I could... I fall into this category, and then learning that, and then discovering how much was missing for patients. 

And I felt the same way as I worked in my journey in intensive care, where I always felt that like, Boy, wouldn't it have been great if we had been able to to reach this person before they got so sick? Yeah, and what would that... what could that look like for people? And how could we start enhancing promotion of health instead of disease? And all that? 

We didn't really have those terms back then. We didn't know how to put language around it, but we knew that something was missing. And I love this, you know, seeking out things that are really calling to us as Nurses, as humans who just love and care for other people. 

And so similar to so many of our listeners who are seeking something that really aligns with their values and who they are today showing up in a different way, potentially than what they started as. So tell us then how lifestyle medicine Nursing really showed up for you.

Karen Laing  09:22

So in 2018 I started watching some webinars that were offered by the American College of Lifestyle Medicine. They were free, informational webinars. There were no CEs attached to them. But I was just fascinated, because these people were saying things that I kept thinking, right? And I found out that there was a... there was going to be an annual meeting in the fall, and they were offering, that year, they offered a scholarship for BSN Nurses. 

Which my master's was not in Nursing, so I wasn't an MSN Nurse, but they offered a scholarship for BSN Nurses that year. I got to take the board prep course. I got to attend the annual conference, which was in Indianapolis that year, and I sat for the board exam and passed it, although you could have told me I failed and I would have believed you, but I was really excited to pass it. 

But I found my tribe. I found my people. At that conference, I was like, these people are saying all the things that I have been feeling and wanting and looking for for years. So I came home, I found out that there was a doctor in Nursing practice with emphasis in lifestyle medicine program at Southern Adventist University in Collegedale, Tennessee. 

And so I came home from that conference and I said to my husband, okay, I figured out what I want to do, because my husband is also a Nurse. He had become a CRNA a number of years earlier, actually, 18 years earlier, prior to me coming home from this conference. And when he had finished his MSNA, he had come home and he said to me, all right, you can work on your PhD now. 

And I said, there's nothing I really want to do. So I came home from that conference and I said, All right, I figured out what I want to do. And he said, Oh no, that offer passed, you know, it expired a number of years ago. And I said, Nope, no, it didn't. So I actually looked into and was accepted into that program. 

But as I talked to people, they kept saying to me, Well, you can always go back and become a Nurse practitioner later, because I was talking to them about what I wanted to do, because I really wanted to be able to make a difference for making lifestyle medicine the norm in healthcare. 

When I found out about the American College of Lifestyle Medicine, I found out there was an organization lobbying in DC to change payment structures so that people can get paid for keeping people well instead of doing procedures on them. I found out that there was this organization that was helping healthcare providers figure out how to get paid for it in their own practice. 

So I was like, All right, if we're going to keep this going forward, I want to get on board, and I want to help make a difference here. And so that's why I decided to go back. I also was doing some academic writing, and, you know, I had to have co authors because I didn't have a terminal degree. And I was like, All right, I need to do this at this time. 

But people kept saying, Oh, well, you can always go back and become a Nurse practitioner. And I thought, yeah, look at me. This is one and done. I'm not going back at this age. So I went to the University of South Florida, USF here in Tampa, and I finished my MSN. I am now an adult Gerontology primary care Nurse practitioner, and I completed my doctorate in Nursing practice. 

So I continued on that journey, and I was able to... my first Nurse practitioner position was with an endocrinologist that I met through a local group here, a lifestyle medicine focused group here, and I worked there for a year, and I am now working in a primary care practice that has an emphasis in lifestyle medicine. So super excited to be able to try to continue making this more of the norm in health care, rather than just putting band aids on things,

Nicole Vienneau  13:53

Such a great pathway that you have traveled— so many twists and turns and then steps and you know, just to get to where you are today. Yeah, so making lifestyle medicine more mainstream, I think for our listeners, would you mind just defining what is lifestyle medicine? What is lifestyle Nursing? Maybe starting with one and then transitioning to the next.

Karen Laing  14:26

Great questions. So lifestyle medicine is an actual medical specialty. It is a board certified lifestyle medicine specialty, and its focus is on the prevention, treatment and potential reversal of chronic disease, which we all know is the number one issue in the United States and in most countries around the world. So that is the definition for lifestyle medicine. 

Lifestyle Nursing, I always like to say, you know, we were actually the ones that started this, because if you look back at Florence Nightingale, what was she doing? She was giving people clean water and sunshine and, you know, making sure that they had clean sheets and good food and all that kind of stuff. The other thing that I didn't say about lifestyle medicine is it is evidence based. 

So it is not because it works for me or my grandma or something like that. There has to be evidence behind the recommendations that we make. And Florence Nightingale had statistics on the work she was doing. So I always say, you know, we were really the ones that started this. But you know, as happens frequently, the physicians took it. 

And one of the things I will say about the American College of Lifestyle Medicine that I absolutely love is it is a interdisciplinary organization. So it was started by physicians, but when you go to the conference, you will be sitting and having dinner with respiratory therapist, a physical therapist, a psychologist, you know, and we're all looking through our different lenses. 

And so it's wonderful to get to have those conversations, because if we are going to positively impact health care, we need everybody on board. We all need to be able to look at it from our perspective and make those changes. You know, because my physical therapy friend can see things that I can't see, and vice versa.

Nicole Vienneau  16:36

And so lifestyle medicine is one category, and then lifestyle Nursing— tell us a little bit more about that. 

Karen Laing  16:46

Sure. So lifestyle medicine, there are six pillars of lifestyle medicine: It's quality sleep, daily stress management, regular physical activity, quality food, strong social connections, and avoidance of risky substances. Now we know, you know, when we look at like the hypertension guidelines, the diabetes guidelines, lifestyle is always at the beginning. 

But what typically happens in a patient visit is, you know, the provider may just assume that the patient doesn't want that, or they may say, well, cut back on carbs, eat more fruits and vegetables. You know, it's very generalized guidance. The interventions that are done in lifestyle medicine, many, most of these are things that any Nurse can do. 

You do not have to be advanced practice to do this. You can have a conversation with a patient at the bedside about, are they sleeping at home? Are they ready to quit smoking? Are, you know, how much do you move? How many fruits and vegetables do you eat every day? Things like this and lifestyle interventions are very specific. 

Now, because we're talking to a coaching community here, we are not being directive. So if you're not ready to quit smoking, we all know this isn't going to help, right? We have to assess where the patient, where the client, is. And the beautiful thing about lifestyle medicine is it is collaborative with the patient. That is part of the definition of lifestyle medicine as well. It is interdisciplinary, and the patient is an active partner. 

I always say, we sell hope, because lots of times patients will come to us, they've got the med list this long, and they just think it's going to keep getting longer. We let them know that this is not what it has to continue being. We can actually make changes, and lifestyle medicine providers will, as appropriate, de-prescribe or decrease the dose on these medications. 

But from the Nursing perspective, it's about being very specific, so making the recommendations instead of saying, you know, eat more fruits and vegetables. You know, well, what's realistic for you at this time? What are you ready to do? So coaches, Nurse coaches are the best at this because we're already used to being able to assess where the client is and what they're ready to make a move on. 

The thing that I think is really wonderful about Nurse coaching and lifestyle medicine is we've got the Nurse hat and we've got the coach hat. So if I'm talking to the patient about physical activity, and I see that their toes are blue, I'm putting the Nurse hat on, because we gotta take care of that first, right? But that's an acute issue. We're talking about dealing with chronic health issues, which is where lifestyle medicine and lifestyle Nursing shine. 

Nicole Vienneau  20:41

Okay. So I think we understand now the difference between the two, but they're not really a difference. It's more of a complement to each other, right? And then we are layering on the art and the science of Nursing with this, and I fully agree with you when you think of Nurses, the majority of Nurses that I speak to on a daily basis love to talk about what they can do with the patient. 

What are things that I can actually have an effect on and having conversations with patients and understanding them better. And then when we're talking about, you know,  alleviating stress, or stress practices, stress reduction practices, avoiding risky substances, physical activity, restorative sleeps, social connections. And what was the other? Nutrition, I think you said. 

I got them all? Did I get them all? Those are things that Nurses are already well versed in. Now we're taking it another level. A level up, it sounds like, because now we're really going... in this course in particular is really understanding the specifics, the specifics of each of these pillars and how they can layer on to help our patients or our clients, our communities, whatever we're deciding to use this framework in.

Karen Laing  22:10

And that's the key word there. Framework. It gives us a structured way to assess the client's lifestyle and a structured way to work on interventions. So I found myself in Nurse coaching, you can, there's a lot of things that you can be assessing, right, and yes, the client is going to guide you. 

As a Nurse coach who is board certified in lifestyle medicine, if I have a patient who wants to come off their hypertension medication, if I have a patient who wants to decrease their diabetes medications, or maybe they're pre-diabetic and they don't want to get there, then I'm not being directive, but I am offering guidance, because these are things that are available to you as an alternative to that. 

If you want to decrease the progression of your disease, decrease the rate of the progression, if you want to reverse, there's actually a clinical practice guideline now, the American College of Lifestyle Medicine has come out with a clinical practice guideline for the remission of type two diabetes. So and these things that are on there, as you said, a lot of them are things that Nurses can do. 

It gives us a framework. It gives us a structure. It gives us language and another way, because we're specifically looking at treating... preventing, treating, and potentially reversing chronic disease. Nurse coaching is a big world. This is a very specific niche within that, I would say. The reason that I'm so passionate about it is because I know how powerful Nurses are, and I want them to know that. 

And we know our healthcare system is broken. We know that it needs to change. It can't continue this way financially, inner-structurally, and Nurses, we are the number one, you know, we are the most... within the healthcare providers, there are more of us than any other healthcare provider. We have the most patient touch interactions, and we are the most trusted profession. 

Now that being said, we also have to model these behaviors. That doesn't mean we have to be perfect, right? Because we don't want to be trying to make our patient or our coaching client feel bad that they can't keep up with us. I had somebody just the other day talking about the fact that, you know, these two guys that are kind of a little pudgy get to the bottom of a hill, they're getting ready to climb up this hill, and they see all these big, really strapping guys come down, and they're like, oh well, we can't do this, you know, we can't climb up that hill, because it doesn't look possible. 

They come back next week and they see some, you know, kind of pudgy guys coming down the hill. Oh yeah, well, we can do this. You know, we want to help make it possible. So we don't want to put on a front that we're perfect. But at the same time, we want to inspire people. I always tell people, we sell hope. We sell hope because we want them to know that there are other possibilities.

Nicole Vienneau  26:01

I love that. Well, it sounds like it is accessible for Nurses to also use these pillars to support themselves.

Karen Laing  26:18

Absolutely. And it's the best place to start, because when you can talk about your struggles and what you have found worked well, you know, it happens quickly, because especially one of my favorite pillars is sleep, because I think it gets overlooked. Matthew Walker is my favorite sleep scientist, and he talks about it being an under appreciated superpower. 

And you know, I always say, if I'm working with a vegan marathoner and they are sleeping four hours a night, they still haven't optimized their health. But how many times does your patient or your client think, well, this is the way I've been. This is the way it is. And they don't know that they could feel better, and if you just give them a few little tips on sleep hygiene and things like that, within a week, they can start feeling better. 

I always encourage people, give it a week, just trust me. You know, because they may be very skeptical. This is one place I'm not directive— you got to do this, you know, like take these pills. But I am a little pushy. I'm a little encouraging, because sometimes they don't think it's possible. 

And I will say, Just trust me. Try it for one week and see if you feel better. Because if you feel better, it'll be worth it. If you don't feel better, we'll talk about something else, but just try this for a week. So you know, those little things that they may not have ever thought were possible, then they start sleeping better. 

They're able to lose weight, which they hadn't been able to lose weight. Their insulin resistance goes down, so then their a1c goes down. You know, they're able to move better. Their knees don't hurt as much. You know, it's a cascade.

Nicole Vienneau  28:20

Yes. And who doesn't like a cascade?

Karen Laing  28:22

Right, and all those things are things that Nurses can do. You didn't have to be a Nurse practitioner to do that.

Nicole Vienneau  28:30

No, and that's why I love lifestyle strategies. Actually, interestingly enough, in my capstone project in my BSN program, I did it on lifestyle behaviors in Nursing, and what Nurses could do for themselves, as things that are no cost, things that are accessible and that you can try. 

And it was just interesting, because I always questioned in Nursing, like, how come... when I was in my BSN, I did my RN to BSN, that's what I was doing. And how come we're not doing more with lifestyle for ourselves? You know, I was curious about that myself, so that's why I did my capstone on that. 

But it makes a difference when, you know, I really heard you say, when we're role models for these behaviors that we're highlighting for our patients. I recall one study was on tobacco cessation. And the Nurses who would try to teach, you know, talk about tobacco cessation that were continuing to smoke themselves really felt like, oh, gosh, here I'm trying to tell this patient to quit smoking, but I still smoke. 

So I'm going to be a little ambivalent about that, and didn't experience that type of success with that, and yet, at the same time, it's like we're all on a journey of just trying to do the best that we can. And so lifestyle strategies seem very accessible for all of us.

Karen Laing  30:19

Yes. And then you mentioned the tobacco cessation. There's also similar research with physical activity. Recommendations are not made. If I'm not moving, I'm not going to tell you to move. Now the other piece of that is, I will say, once you start doing this work, you will find that you feel held accountable, because you can't ask somebody to do something you're not doing.

Nicole Vienneau  30:44

Right. But I love that about these courses with the Integrative Nurse Coach Academy. It's like whoa, here I am learning all of these things that are really going to support my patients, my clients, my communities, and boy, they're going to support myself in my own journey, and then I'm learning more about that, those things, I'm starting to feel better, and then that all weaves together to really be able to elevate the best outcomes for our patients.

Karen Laing  31:13

Absolutely, absolutely. Because people are watching us. We may not realize it, but they are watching us. And so when we start feeling better, they're going to also wonder why.

Nicole Vienneau  31:24

Yeah, and also, if she could do it, I could do it. I love that. Okay, so I know our listeners want to know a little bit more about the specifics of our course. So, I know it's going to be about 65 contact hours, and it's an online program. So tell us a little bit more about the details.

Karen Laing  31:50

Okay, so it's going to have a rolling enrollment, meaning you can sign up at any time. You'll have access to the course for 12 months. There will be 12 modules. We're going to cover each of the pillars, as well as some of the, you know, the primary chronic diseases like hypertension and diabetes, things like that. 

And I'm super excited because I have pulled in some of my other lifestyle Nursing colleagues who have been very generous with me, and because I didn't want you to just learn from me, because it's just my lens, I wanted you to be able to see through other lenses. And so I am interviewing at least 11 Nurses who work in lifestyle Nursing, and I have one patient interview who has benefited from lifestyle interventions. 

I love him, and I've worked with him before. So for each of the modules, there will be content. There will, you know, this is the details. You know, we will have the structured information about each of the pillars, and then specifically on those chronic disease states. And then there will be an opportunity for you to kind of pull it together at the end for your clinical situation, your personal situation, but then for each of the modules, there will also be an interview. 

So you'll be able to, you know, in some of the specific resources that that Nurse finds valuable, and as, you know, tapped into over the years, things like that. So I'm going to have links in each module for those as well. So there will be quite a wealth of information all pulled together within these 12 modules. We also will be having, at least once a month, a live Zoom meeting. 

So if you have questions, if you have comments, if you want to get together with the rest of the group that's in the course at that time. One thing that I can tell you about lifestyle medicine is sometimes it can be a little challenging. Nurse coaches know some of this as well, because you know you're doing something that's different from the norm, but lifestyle medicine can feel a little challenging. 

Lifestyle Nursing. I have recently started a new position, and I'm doing some orienting with some other healthcare providers, and I'm in a practice that values lifestyle, but some of the recommendations that are being made are not ones that I would have made. And so, you know, I have to really, you know, I'm kind of... I always say I feel like I'm out there bushwhacking, you know, because I'm doing something different from what everybody else is doing. 

Not everybody, but the majority of the practice. So, you know, you are doing something new and something different when you are at the bedside, talking to the patient about physical activity and how that can help their hypertension, versus just talking to them about their education on the medication. 

Your colleagues may think you're wasting your time, so it's nice to come together with other people who recognize the value and that this actually can make a difference. Lots of times, we don't give enough value to these interventions. We don't recognize that yes, it can make a difference. 

You start being physically active it doesn't have to necessarily be that 30 minutes every day, you know, with your strength training twice a week and all that. That's great. But if we can get you off the couch, you know, and walk around the house once a day, we've made progress, and it keeps going from there. 

And as you keep doing this, we may find that we eventually are able to decrease some of these medications, and that is where the healthcare provider comes in, but a lot of times, Nurses can make these recommendations. And I'm sure we've all been in the situation where the provider's in there talking to the patient, they say, Do you have any other questions? 

And they say, No, and they walk out of the room, and then they turn to you and start, you know, what do they mean by this, that and the other thing? You know, so we have their ears, you know, they will listen to us.

Nicole Vienneau  36:27

That's true. It's true. Love it. Yes, and I know I mentioned this earlier in our interview, but the specifics, I think, are really important for our listeners to understand, because sometimes you think, Oh, well, I don't really know exactly what to do for physical activity or what to recommend. And so this framework will be very specific in offering, oh, here, you know, patient recommendations and for different also for different disease processes too it sounds like. 

So instead of kind of like saying, Well, yeah, you can just go walk around the block, you can actually be clear with what some recommendations may be, of course. And of course, using a coaching model, if you happen to be a coach, of how that would evolve for the client.

Karen Laing  37:20

Yes, yes. And a lot of these, even for those who aren't coaches, there are having a coach approach and involving, as I mentioned, you know, the patient is, or the client is, an active participant in this. So that is very much, coachy, Nurse coachy, even for those of you who may not be coaches, per se, but you will definitely, we're still going to be focusing on some of those skills, yes.

Nicole Vienneau  37:52

And so that's awesome, yeah. And I feel really, Nurses are so aligned with learning this, like not just lifestyle, but how to really approach a patient so that they become a partner, instead of us telling them what to do, because we know it doesn't work. 

We see it day in and day out, but when we can really have those meaningful connections and conversation, it creates that openness between the patient and the Nurse, and then it brings satisfaction to us as Nurses, because we're really feeling like we're connecting with the patients and clients and communities.

Karen Laing  38:30

I think one of the things that's really important is to realize that in order to do these interventions, it doesn't have to be a long period of time, because sometimes we think, you know, we are time crunched, right? So sometimes it doesn't seem possible. 

Oh, you know, I've already got all these things they want me to do, and now this woman wants me to add, you know, talking to my patient about physical activity, recognizing some of the things we're going to be talking about in this course are how to get those little powerful bites in there. Because we have data showing that these brief interactions can be super powerful.

Nicole Vienneau  39:19

They really can, I just love it. Okay, let's see, what other kinds of things do I want to ask. So the Integrative Nurse Coach Academy has another course called Functional Nursing, which is also a framework for functional medicine, but Nurses understanding those principles, and I understand that we could potentially take both of those classes.

Karen Laing  39:50

Correct, and what a wonderful resource.

Nicole Vienneau  39:52

Like do a dual certificate pathway with both courses together. So I'm curious how all of that works.

Karen Laing  40:02

Excellent question. Excellent question. So functional medicine, that's not my area of specialty, but we have worked together for these two courses because there are things in functional medicine, functional Nursing, that are similar values to lifestyle Nursing, and so we didn't want to just be rehashing the same thing in the second course. 

So when you look at lifestyle Nursing, you are going to be looking at those pillars, that foundation, and then, of course, some of those things, they'll be touching on more briefly in the functional medicine, functional Nursing course. I always tell people I am not against supplements. I am not against other testing, things like that. 

I do want to make sure we've got a strong foundation first, because if we get this strong foundation in place, you may find you don't need to go further. So that's kind of the progression there. With lifestyle Nursing, we can help our patients, help our clients, have that strong foundation, and then if they need something further, or if they're having an acute issue, that's not a specialty for lifestyle Nursing. 

We're dealing with those chronic issues either prevention, treatment or reversal. So then functional Nursing, functional medicine would be, you know, kind of the next step there. So that's... does that answer? Is that understandable for how those two fit together in this case?

Nicole Vienneau  41:42

Yeah, and it seems like many of our listeners would be like, oh, I want to take both of those classes. Yeah. And so this just offers a way to be able to do that at a discounted rate, too, if you want to take both of them. So yeah, all the learning, soak it up. Yes, I love that. Yeah. So I do have a... I see, Karen, to the right of you, in the back there is a book, and it says, Lifestyle Nursing.

Karen Laing  42:17

Yeah. So this book is going to be one that will be utilized in the course. I luckily was... I was able... I was kind of like a editorial consultant on the book, and then had the opportunity to co-author two chapters in the book, and it is a great resource for Nurses. It's not focused on APRNs. 

It's focused on any Nurse. It could be LPN, RN, APRN. This book is written to everybody, so it talks about why lifestyle medicine is appropriate for Nurses, and then talks about specific areas. One of the chapters that I worked on was smoking cessation. So you know, one of my loves, and while we're here...

Nicole Vienneau  43:13

Well before you go to that book, before you go there, could you read the name of that textbook? Because maybe our listeners would just like to know that a little bit better.

Karen Laing  43:23

It's Lifestyle Nursing.

Nicole Vienneau  43:27

Just Lifestyle Nursing. And then who are the authors?

Karen Laing  43:30

So it's edited by Dr. Gia Merlo, and Gia Merlo is a physician who we have crowned as an honorary Nurse. She works in the Department of Nursing at NYU, and she has been a huge champion for Nurses in lifestyle medicine, and then Kathy Berra MSN, and she's a Nurse practitioner and a fellow of the American Nurses Association. She has been very active in the Preventive Cardiovascular Nurses Association, which is another organization that I'm very active in, and she's the second editor on this book.

Nicole Vienneau  44:14

Wonderful. Okay, so all our listeners, I will definitely put this into the show notes, so that it is accessible, so that you can find out more about this. Okay, alright, now let's see this next goodie you have for us.

Karen Laing  44:28

Alright. So this lifestyle Nursing book was the first one that came out, specifically focused on Nurses. The next one that came out is this one, Health Promotion and Disease Prevention for Advanced Practice. So this one is focused more on the Advanced Practice Nurse. Loureen Downes and Lilly Tryon, both Nurses who works— Lilly Tryon works at Southern Adventist University and Loureen Downes works at Florida Gulf Coast University, and they are the editors on that book. 

The subtitle on that is Integrating Evidence Based Lifestyle Concepts. So two great resources. The other thing that's super exciting, I don't have a copy of it here, but James Rippe does a series on lifestyle medicine. He's got a lot of different things about physical activity, women's health, things like that. 

But he also has a huge book that comes out, and in the fourth edition, they added a section on Nursing, and I was honored to be able to write a chapter for that. So that is a super exciting thing to see that we are now being recognized in the giant book of lifestyle medicine.

Nicole Vienneau  45:15

Yay! Thank you for your work on that and bringing it to life for Nurses and, you know, really, really pushing to have this as part of, you know, something that we can do, because we're already so darn good at it, and we do need more knowledge to really support. So this, so your course, is really going to help with all of that.

Karen Laing  46:21

One thing that I do find with Nurses is lots of times Nurses have concerns about this being within their scope, particularly around food and physical activity. You know, with food, they feel that they can't give nutritional guidance. That's the area for the dietitian. Now, if somebody is newly diagnosed, you know, with celiac disease, yes, that's true. 

That is not something that is my specialty, right? But I can talk to you about eating more beans. I can talk to you about eating more fruits and vegetables. I can educate you on, you know, letting go of the soda and adding more water into your daily diet. Things like this are all within the scope of Nursing. 

Physical activity— same thing, you know, I'm not coming up with an exercise plan for you, but I can help you get off the couch and safely start moving. These are things that we can do. We are educators, you know, we have that information. We can help make it... we can translate it into a form that our patients and clients can use.

Nicole Vienneau  47:46

I love that, yes, this translation, we can make it relevant and clearer and more supportive to the individual.

Karen Laing  47:55

Right. And it's really important that, you know, I know I said it before, but it's got to be evidence based. So I have recently been working on... I had a student Nurse practitioner approach me because she wanted me to work on a poster with her for an upcoming Nurse practitioner meeting in Florida, and functional medicine is her interest. 

Functional Nursing. And she knew that we shared a lot of you know, they share a lot of those same tenants. And so as we started looking at the topic that she wanted to do the poster on, there is someone within the functional medicine world who you would know, who she was looking to for guidance, and as she looked at some of the information that he put out, his references aren't strong, reliable references. 

But unless she had looked at that, she would not know that. Well, our patients are in the same boat, right? They need us to help them realize that just because someone says it on Instagram doesn't make it so, you know, even if six people on my block follow this guide, that does not make it true. 

So helping our patients and our clients recognize what is actually evidence based. I had somebody recently, there was a post on Facebook, and I generally don't engage in these things, but sometimes what I do is I just ask questions. I'll say, please share the evidence. You know, I'm interested in learning. I am interested in learning. So you know, I'll say, I have an honest question. Please share that with me, you know, because I want to know. Well, you know, 9 times out of 10 it's not there.

Nicole Vienneau  50:03

Yes. So we all need a little bit of help. Even if you have 1 million followers, you know,  mixed messaging, so many things that are unclear or vague, yeah. So we need this clarity. This clarity is very important, especially in today's day and age.

Karen Laing  50:26

Yes, because too much information can lead to paralysis. I'm overwhelmed. I have no idea. This diet, that diet, I don't know, you know, or it's the what time do I exercise and what's the best exercise? The best exercise is the one you will do, just so you know.

Nicole Vienneau  50:45

Exactly. So Karen, in her last few moments together, we always love to ask this question, and you can take a few moments to just see, see how you feel, what comes up for you. So the question is, what is on your heart that you would love to share with our listeners?

Karen Laing  51:09

I'm almost getting teary here. You have more power than you think you do. So, as Nurses, frequently, we do not give ourselves enough credit. Recognize the power that you have. We're not trying to be aggressive, but we're so good at being patient advocates. Let's advocate for ourselves and for the healthcare system. 

Nicole Vienneau  51:40

I just got chills. 

Karen Laing  51:42

I just, I have such a passion for Nurses, you know, thank goodness I didn't go to medical school.

Nicole Vienneau  51:52

Oh my gosh, yes. Thank goodness, thank goodness. And then I have just one personal question, is I also see behind you, on your shelves, you have some figures and I'm curious to just see, maybe pull one down and just tell us a little bit about one of them, if you feel comfortable doing that.

Karen Laing  52:11

Oh, there's so many special things here, but my mother-in-law was probably one of my biggest supporters throughout my life. This woman had... she came from England, she lived through World War 2, and she was a war bride. She came to the US, she was pregnant, and her husband left her on the night that she went into labor with her child, and she ended up living with his family for a while. 

She was a single mom in DC in the 50s, and she was one of the most positive individuals I have ever known, and she was always supportive, always an encourager to everyone. And these little things are just... she liked to learn new things. And these are little things that she whittled. And she would deliver meals on wheels when she was 75, she delivered meals on wheels to the old people, and took line dancing classes, and she is one of my role models.

Nicole Vienneau  53:28

What a wonderful representation and memories of her. So for our listeners who can't see, Karen, hold them up again one more time. So there is a little... these are both wood... is this wood?

Karen Laing  53:39

It is. One is a little... I think maybe, maybe this one's supposed to be a polar bear. She whittled, she wasn't very good at it. She enjoyed it. And then the other one is a duck. We've got a dog and another duck up here too, that she whittled. But yes, yeah, she enjoyed learning new things and did it well into later life.

Nicole Vienneau  54:09

I love it. All right. Well, thank you so much, Karen, for sharing all of your beautiful wisdom, powerful wisdom, and sharing with us about your new specialty course called Lifestyle Nursing: A Lifestyle Medicine Framework for Nurses. I am going to share the link of course for this program in our show notes. I also... your email, is that the best way to contact? How should we follow up with you? If we have questions, our listeners are listening like I want to ask this question, is it okay?

Karen Laing  54:45

Absolutely, absolutely, please feel free to reach out via email. You know, this may have brought up more questions than answers, and I am happy to field those whether or not you're planning to enroll in the course. I am happy to talk to you, and would welcome any feedback or questions comments that you have. And thank you so much Nicole for this opportunity to share about the course and share about my passion for Nurses and lifestyle Nursing in particular.