Nicole Vienneau  00:00

Welcome, everyone, to the Integrative Nurse Coaches in ACTION! podcast. My name is Nicole Vienneau. I am your host, and I'm also a board-certified integrative Nurse Coach. And I have the absolute pleasure of getting to interview Nurses from all over the world who are using integrative Nurse Coaching in their practice, making it their own unique way of showing up in the world. 

And today is a special day because we are inviting a guest who originally started in North Carolina and now has transitioned to move to New Jersey, which I'm sure is a big switch. And he's incorporating integrative Nurse Coaching in a very unique way, and so let's just welcome him. Let's welcome Chad Sanders.

Chad Sanders  00:50

Oh, I'm so excited to be here-a piece of the collective energy and the quality, the joy we all bring to Nurse Coaching.

Nicole Vienneau  00:59

Awesome! Yes, I'm so excited you're here too, and I look forward to all the wisdom that you will share with us and as a collective, right? As a collective, I love that. Okay, so Chad, we always go down history lane first, and so we'd love to know and have you share a little bit about your history. Why did you even become a Nurse?

Chad Sanders  01:21

Yeah, no, that's a great question because most people look at me, they're not necessarily... a first guess is not Nurse. Some people maybe, but that's the beauty of Nursing is we need all sorts of perspectives, backgrounds, Nurses and coaches. But no, when I thought about that, you know, several times like what really got me into Nursing, and it was multiple things. 

I think the biggest piece was just the human connection and healing aspect, just trying to build people up in my mind. But my mom was a physical therapist, so I was kind of around some you know healthcare related topics and themes, and my best friend's mom growing up was also a Nurse, and I remember seeing her. She was a pediatric Nurse. 

I was like, oh man, she looks like she has so much fun. She didn't tell me about the burnout, but it came with Nursing. But so that inspired me. I was like, okay, it's a people person job. It's kind of... I could tap... I was always attracted before I guess the whole person care. 

We learned about Nursing school, but I saw that in my, in some in my mom PT, but also in my best friend's mom and her work. And I was like, okay, I get paid for this. It's holistic. It's integrative. And I didn't want to prescribe meds, so I didn't want to become a doctor. 

And I was like, okay, Nursing's what it is. So I had that. You know, I knew right away I wanted to be a Nurse. And then part of it was also a spiritual calling, like helping people. You know, serving was an element of that too. So those are kind of some of the themes that attracted me to Nursing.

Nicole Vienneau  03:05

Yeah, the whole person approach, the spirituality, the connectedness. Yeah, and then also you know just for me it was also about learning the science and understanding the body better and yeah, cool. All right, so tell us a little bit about some of your experiences as a Nurse, like your specialties or kind of that process to where you are today.

Chad Sanders  03:32

Well, I want to start with my first day of graduation, and this is before I was working as a Nurse, right? But we graduated, and I don't know about y'all, but the struggle was real. Nursing school was not easy, you know. And so when I graduated, one, I wore every single medal I've had in my entire life, from like six years old all the way up to Nursing, and I didn't get honors in Nursing. 

I passed, you know. And I passed my NCLEX first try. Doesn't matter, as long as you pass. But so I wore all that. But also, it was kind of my humor, which we'll get into humor as one, you know, that's one of my... playfulness is just a part of who I am, and personal, and then trying to bring that even into Nursing. 

You know, but when I graduated, they let us change our name, you know, for pronunciation purposes on the card when they announced us that we're graduating. I was like, you know what? I'm gonna change my name to Nightingale, and so I changed my middle name. I marked it out and I wrote Nightingale. 

And so when they announced on graduation day they're like, technically I am Chad, but Charles is my official name. They're like, Charles Nightingale Sanders graduates with his… and like half the audience got it, half didn't, and I just loved it and I didn't realize what legacy I was stepping into you know when I learned with Barbara Dossey how Florence Nightingale predicted it would take like, I mean in the training she mentioned it like 100 to 150 years for Nurses to be in the position to affect healthcare, you know, change the way that she envisioned. 

And I didn't know I was really stepping into that legacy, just being playful there. But there was more, and so it was just a fun way, and then had deeper meaning later as I learned more about Florence Nightingale and some of the Nurse Coaching training.

Nicole Vienneau  05:22

Before you go there, I'm just imagining you wearing all your medals. So, little younger Chad Nightingale...

Chad Sanders  05:30

Yeah, I wore my gymnastics. I had soccer medals, gymnastics. I had probably honorable mention ribbons from high school, because all of it led to Nursing, right? And so I was like, I could justify. I was like, all this led to where I'm at right now. Plus, I was like, the struggle was real. Like, I didn't get honors. I didn't graduate top of my class, but I graduated. 

Nicole Vienneau  05:55

But you graduated. Well, and you know what? It doesn't even matter because you're right. I mean, in the end, what I loved about this is, you said all of that brought you to where you are today, right? In that moment, all of the awards, yeah, but all of your experiences, everything are coming with you into this amazing profession.

Chad Sanders  06:18

Yes, and I'm glad you reflected that because that's really what coaching is. When you're working with someone, yeah, you're not necessarily diving into all that, but you're trying to bring that whole person to the coaching practice, not just hey, you got to eat better. No, what is important to you? Who are you? You know, and then hey, what are the challenges? What are the hopes? And then diving in that coaching conversation and listen to what's important to them. But yeah, it applies to us too, right?

Nicole Vienneau  06:46

It does. Yes.

Chad Sanders  06:47

I didn't realize that's what I was doing in the moment. That's probably my ego, like I want all these medals, but you know, it was still fun. 

Nicole Vienneau  06:56

Yeah, for sure, and great conversation starters for sure. Okay, keep going with your history.

Chad Sanders  07:04

Then, you know, so when I went into Nursing, I didn't …actually, I had one thought too that when I was reflecting on this, I remember in actually Nursing training, we were some rotation and a pharmacist I was speaking to, and of course we're learning about pharmacy, and I was like, you know, the topic came up. 

You know, some of these changes could be made with healthy lifestyle changes. And I was like, why aren't we doing this more? And he, I remember this person, I don't even know who it was, but it was some pharmacist on a rotation, and they gave me insights into the system that there is this battle from, you know, symptom management, disease management to well-being, and there's a transformation that's obviously happening, but it takes time. 

And it was like, oh, the system's not going to change, you know, they're not going to. And I was like, nah. And in my mind, I was like, no, Nursing's holistic. We're going to do this, you know. And when I got into Nursing, I realized, okay, the system is designed for symptom management. So my first job, I started off on really I just went where I could find a job. 

I went to like a telemetry floor, started work. I was like, let me get some experience. And honestly, so in 2009, my first job, and I immediately experienced burnout, like, cause, and I just remember, and I probably could justify and be like, Oh, I'm a new Nurse. It takes time, which is true, to develop skills from, I guess, Pat... Who is it? Pat Benner, the Nurse theory, novice, expert. 

It is going to take time, whether that's coaching or a different. So some of that made sense, but I was like, this constant battle, like, why, like, what are we doing? Just passing meds, quick education, checking boxes, in and out, and I just remember there was this internal battle that I always felt between okay, this is where I can get a job right now, but this is against how I understood Nursing, you know, and the care we're supposed to provide, but yet this conflict we're not always able to provide it. 

So I had that theme kind of come up in my first year. So I was like, okay, maybe I just need a different, you know, go to a different specialty type of Nurse. And so, and some of that was true. And so, well, the transition... My first year as a Nurse, I broke my leg and had to go on FMLA for four months, and during that time, I really realized, okay, I don't... telemetry is not really my calling. 

It was great, you know. So when I came back, I transitioned to inpatient psych, and that was really most of my clinical experience was in psychiatry. And part of that transition was I felt like I could spend more time with patients, which is true, right? And it was more conversational. However, it still had some of the same challenges, symptom management, in and out. 

So I had those still systemic barriers and challenges to the care I wanted to provide. But that really opened me up to more holistic actually aspect. You know, mind, body, spirit. And caring for the inpatient population. And from there, I was still struggling. Like, how do I find really what I want? Like, I love this, but it's not where I want to be. 

So, of course, in my mind, I'm like, okay, I'll go Nurse practitioner route. And then, as soon as I did that, I was thinking about that. I was like, this is not really what I want to do. I would love the training. I would love the knowledge, but I was like, you know, I want to focus on like transformation, helping people change, you know, meeting them where they're at. And so my mom actually sent me a link. The hospital I was working at, they had a coaching program, one of the first coaching programs that existed, I was like, okay, oh, health coaching, yeah, let me go into that. 

So I first was introduced to health coaching through Duke Integrative Medicine, which I think now is called Duke Health and Wellbeing. But I was like, oh, this is amazing! I'm gonna go in there, I'm have all this knowledge and help coach people, right? And then coaching in my mind, of course, I don't know if most people experience this, but coaching is not just telling people what to do. 

There could be some overlaps, Nursing education, or you want to… if there's a knowledge deficit, we want to share. But also, we have a knowledge deficit in the patient, so we need to be curious about what really inspires them, who they are, what they want, the barriers, what they already know, what they're willing to change. Coaching, right? 

And so I was first introduced to motivational interviewing in that program, but I was like, it took me back because I was like, oh, coaching isn't just like yeah, they trained us on lifestyle interventions, mindfulness, holistic practice, but really coaching was about empowering that person, who they are, what they want to become, and helping them through that process, guiding that process through the conversation. 

So that really inspired me, and I was like, Wait, this! And so that program had doctors, Nurses, business professionals. It was open to all, which was pretty incredible. But I was like, You know, I want to connect this to Nursing, and that's when I kind of discovered INCA and Nurse Coaching. 

I was like, Oh wait, they have a Nurse Coaching training specific for coaching. So I pursued that back in I think 2014, and it was… I went to the cohort, one of the cohorts down in Miami, which was also fun. I was like, I get to go learn about Nursing down in Miami. That's gonna be fun.

Nicole Vienneau  12:22

Sign me up! 

Chad Sanders  12:22

Sign me up, yeah, and oh, it was just so transformational, right? And so became trained as an integrative Nurse Coach. Sat for the board in 2015 and passed my Nurse Coach board certification. I was like, yes, I'm gonna open up my own business. I'm gonna thrive. I know I can do stuff, and then I was like, okay, there's more to it than just doing it. 

And so I you know since then I have never left a full time Nursing job. However, I've done both things, pursued Nurse Coaching avenues within organizations I worked in, or tried to help advocate for that, and then also open up more of a side hustle practice, and like that's evolved through the years about really what I want to do in that. 

So I'm fortunate to practice coaching skills on a regular basis, and so when I graduated from the... or became board certified, I was like, okay, I want more training and coaching, and part of that was like fear. I was like, I need a little more training. I'm board certified, but I need a little more, right? And so that led me to I did my master's in applied positive psychology and coaching psychology, which was incredible program. 

And so I worked on the weekend as a Nurse, still inpatient psych, and then you know became got my master's in applied positive psychology and coaching psychology. And when I graduated from that program, a position opened up in hospital: stress management, Nurse clinician and coach. 

So for four years, I was able to really, it was more you know specific to stress management, wasn't like building a full-time coaching relationship, but it was inpatient helping patients cope with their hospitalization, and I got to use direct coaching skills, helping, hey, what's going to help you work through your hospitalization now? 

What's important, and then teaching some relaxation techniques. And so I did it for four years, and then out the side in my side business, Connect Wellness, which has evolved through the years, and we get to really where the vision that I see now that it's evolved to. But it was like, okay, word of mouth. I'll have a coach here, coaching client, or I connect with another organization that wanted some coaching. So I would still do that part time, right? 

But still working full time. So it was like, and part of it was the struggle when you grow. Like, how, what do you do? Because coaching was becoming more mainstream, popular, but it still wasn't…they weren't hiring tons of coaches internally, so you could kind of create that within your organization, but took time and building relationships, or you go out on your own, which is great. 

And actually, when I listened to your podcast, it resonated. That fear-it's still there, like showing up and nobody's there. Or you got one client, but wait, how do I pay the bills if I only got one client? You know, but it's like finding that balance. How do you do that? You know, and so, but I really liked actually when I listened to your podcast, what resonated was like that perspective because oh, if no one shows up for something, oh, I'm here. 

So the time for yourself that I was like, okay, yes, we want a lot of people, like we want to build, but okay, no, there is something you can get from it even if you know in that in that evolution of you know whatever you do as a Nurse Coach. So, but my journey evolved, and then I got married, and so that's what sparked my transition to New Jersey. 

And so when people ask where I'm from, I say I tell them South Jersey now, and then they're like, "What?" I'm like, "No, technically North Carolina, but I live in New Jersey." Because my accent. So sometimes, you know, just that little playful-that's the playful nature that kind of comes out. But it led to an incredible opportunity as they were hiring a specific Nurse Coach, a clinical Nurse Coach. 

So it does have some of the traditional Nursing education, and so on a regular basis, you know, I'm working with clients for lifestyle change, behavioral change, health coaching with some education around diabetes, health and wellness. But then also we get to lead character strength groups, mindfulness groups. 

So it's a direct coaching role in still tapping into Nursing, traditional Nursing education and holistic practices, which is incredible. However, what I'm really interested in sharing here, and that's incredible work that allows me to practice these skills, to stay within some traditional Nursing and holistic Nursing, but also gives me real connection to the struggle. 

Because healthcare, you know, these days has a lot of joys and a lot of pains, and so that's really what led me to, you know, with my vision for Connect Wellness, as it's evolved, is really, and this sparked even in the Nurse Coaching training, is really empowering healthcare professionals- Nurses, starting with that, but other health coaches, doctors are burnt out, pharmacists, everybody's burnt out, and I don't want… that's kind of a blanket statement. I'm sure there's some that aren't burnt out. But a lot are. 

Nicole Vienneau  12:22

Okay, a lot. Yes. All right. So let's pause for a moment.

Chad Sanders  12:22

Yeah because I'm gonna keep going. 

Nicole Vienneau  12:22

Yeah, I love it. Because we really want to talk about what you're doing today, what your vision is as it's going forward. Because there's a lot of evolution that's happened since even your first day of graduation, and then rolling into a job where you thought, okay, this is it. I take this job, the only one I could find. 

But you know, I take this job. But a lot of Nurses are faced with this, right? We're going to take the very first job, and we're going to get that one year on med telemetry or whatever it is, and get that experience, and then all of a sudden, it's like, holy crap! Here we are faced with the realities of what we really are going to be doing day to day. 

And I heard you talk about a lot of this mismatch of our values, of what our strengths are, and now we're being corralled into having to function in a space that may not align with any of that, and we need to pay our bills. We've got loans, we've got life, we've got families that we need to sustain. All of those things and that pressure that's associated with that, and then how that affects our own mental health and our capacity to keep on giving in a profession that is very much giving. So there was that I heard.

Chad Sanders  13:40

And thank you for bringing it up because it's a constant. Even now, even I'm blessed. I'm so lucky to be able to practice coaching, but even in a system that still, I feel like, and this is personal, other Nurses may agree, but it's-I feel like it's against our Nursing values. 

I mean, we're trained to put our biases aside, to meet people where they're at, try to take care of them, but yet the system, like sometimes the care we want to provide, we can't provide because the system doesn't allow it. So there's like this moral tension, this conflict. 

And I coin it now as, and don't get me wrong, I want profit, I want to, we all want to make money, but I coin it as you know we practice and we went from patient-centered care to profit-centered care. And really, it's always been there, and it is what it is. 

We're in the system and we're evolving, and so like I feel like there's this tension that's always present, you know, and so I was like, How do I deal with that? Because you know, and so coaching was empowering, and I guess these trainings really focusing on our well-being, our self-development, our foundational first, as just as important as the care we're providing. 

And sometimes it goes back. Sometimes, hey, I'm underusing my wellness. I'm not focused on myself and over focusing on my work, and so it's really that balance you want to have. And I think there was a model that I really loved in one of the coaching trainings. 

It had a picture of the patient. It was a Nurse Coaching, one of the textbooks, or maybe it was, but it was the patient on one side, the Nurse on the other side. It was like half and half, and it was like it was a beautiful thing. It was like coaching, yes, you're coaching that person that moment, but if you're not noticing, hey, where's my mind wandering? 

I'm not present with this patient because my well-being needs, that can impact the coaching relationship or Nursing relationship. And it was like a mirror. Like yes, we're coaching that person, but we also have to nurture ourselves, and so I love that about the coaching trainings, and really INCA and Nurse Coaching, is foundational, is self care.

Nicole Vienneau  21:12

Yeah, for sure. Okay, now there's some other themes in here I just want to pull up before we hear exactly what you're doing today with Connect Wellness. I'd love to know, you mentioned the Nurse Coaching programs were transformational, that's pretty general, so tell us what you mean.

Chad Sanders  21:33

Well, I think I'll have one experience that just still resonates with me. It's like it's empowering because one is you're developing these skills that can empower you as a Nurse, right? Whether and some Nurses do become Nurse practitioners, which they have that scope of practice, they can diagnose and quality. But there's another skill set on top of that or lens. 

And so that was really just empowering to me. Hey, having this practice, you can work with people. You can open up your own business if you want it. You can try to advocate for this in your hospital, and it's transformational work in helping people change. But part of the training was focused on ourselves, whether we were you know doing triads or dyads, peer coaching, and so it was this both learning about the skills of coaching, but also learning about yourself at deeper levels, right? 

In the training. So that's what's so transformational about it. It wasn't just oh come learn this. No, who are you? How are you present with someone? How are you focused on your  well being. So that was that piece of transformation. And then one I remember one quote, Barbie Dossey, and she did incredible and I was lucky. 

She was, you know, helped teach at some of our trainings. And I remember one time she said, and we had some great Nurses in our cohort, and I was like, and I'm fun, I'm good, but I was like, I'm not, like I'm not a Nurse practitioner. I'm like, I kind of was like, ah, I'm good. I valued myself and my skills, and I had some coaching background, so I was like, Oh, cool! I got a little coaching knowledge. 

But she really said something that was just, she said something that stuck stood out to me. I don't know. We were just talking after one of the trainings. She was like, "You're a young Nurse leader", and I was like, "Oh, thank you." I mean, I am young, not anymore, but no, but  it was just empowering to hear. 

Okay, yeah, I'm a Nurse leader because you know when you're working on the floor at the time, or sometimes you don't feel like you know you're making much change, or you know unless you're a manager or unless you're at the top. No, you're a leader on the floor. You're a leader in whatever position. So that was just really empowering. So her words are just transformation. 

She's just a powerful visionary for Nurse Coaching and Nursing, and so that stood out to me. However, when I got back, I did go after that. The struggle, and this is being a little vulnerable. When I left that training, I got back in the work I was at, I got on my first, first and only performance improvement plan, and I remember I was like, Wait, I'm a Nurse leader, but I'm on this performance improvement plan. So it was like this. 

Oh, I was like, No. So I had to practice the mindfulness skills. We won't get in the details of that because I was like, you know, I could adjust anyway, but it was just like, okay, no, and but actually, that led me to get my train. 

Like, I switched the role because it wasn't fully aligned with what I wanted to fully do, and it ended up leading to something better, which doesn't always happen when you go through challenges and Nursing, but this one did, and that's when I was able to get my master's, and eventually step into that stress management role.

Nicole Vienneau  24:45

Yeah. Well, thanks for sharing your vulnerability because as our listeners hear these things, they're like, "Oh, that's me."

Chad Sanders  24:54

Yeah. Exactly.

Nicole Vienneau  24:56

"Oh, I experienced that too, or I'm going through something like that right now, and so, I'm not the only one." Yeah, yeah. And these challenges, of course, help us. And thank gosh, sometimes I've been in a lot of challenges in my life. I'm like, thank goodness that happened. I didn't see it at the time, but now I'm like...

Chad Sanders  24:56

Yeah. Like I'm glad it helped me shift my perspective. What I wanted, even though in the time it was not fun.

Nicole Vienneau  25:26

Right.

Chad Sanders  25:27

I didn't think it fair, anyway. All that stuff, but...

Nicole Vienneau  25:30

Yeah, it's not fun at all. And yeah, after coming off such a high...

Chad Sanders  25:35

Yeah, I was like, wait, hold on, I'm a leader.

Nicole Vienneau  25:37

Yeah, that's a real sucker punch right there. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh man. Okay. Well, I really enjoyed just touching on a few of those little snippets. For us to understand you a little bit more and hear your voice a little bit more. All right, so now I think we're ready.

Chad Sanders  26:03

Yeah!

Nicole Vienneau  26:04

What you're doing now, what your vision is for today. 

Chad Sanders  26:07

Well, it still ties into the same transformational element that I got in the Nurse Coaching training is that we have to focus and nurture ourselves, and what does that really mean? And that's all individual, right? Of course, it's lifestyle. It's it's managing our, you know, our sleep, our nutrition, our exercise. So movement has always been a big part of my life, right? 

And actually, when I look back at it, you know, as a kid, my parents used to say I used to come home. Maybe I was probably six or seven. I would just turn on the music and dance for hours, just in the living room. I don't know why. Just always music movement was also fun. Then that evolved as I aged to just I became a mascot in high school, which is fun playfulness, right? 

You think how is this tied into Nursing? I'll share how it's tied into Nursing. Right, right. And then, of course, just you know, at a wedding or at a party, just the energy you get, the joy from dancing, from movement, from music, it was just really empowering. And then in the college, even doing mascoting, and then getting into social dancing, like salsa, zook, bachata. Of course, hip hop. Just dancing was just for fun. 

It was fun, expressive self care. And I, my first experience when I blended that on the Nursing unit was actually it was a float Nurse. My first year as a Nurse, it wasn't on our job description at the time, but when we were struggling on the shift, we would, I just remember we would, we connected. She would float from us, time to time. But we would do like random dance moves in the hallway, you know, as just like a little... I don't know. 

Just spontaneous, but it was fun and it helped us get through the shift, right? Just that playfulness and that, you know, connection with other, and still having to go face the the realities of a 12-hour shift, but that was where I first got a piece of it. I was like, oh, wait, dancing. There's something about this that can be more than just dance. It's deeper levels. 

And so when I was inpatient psych, actually I was lucky. My the director of our psych unit at the time, for her DMP, she studied falls reduction in the inpatient population, psychiatric population, and she used dance. It was more line dancing in her research. How that actually helped reduce falls risk. But of course, in the psychiatric, you know, mental health, behavioral health clinic, you want to assess the milieu, how patients interact, and so you can do lots of clinical things within that. 

It's a powerful movement group. It helped reduce falls in her study, it showed, because it built coordination. You know, I'd have to pull up our study's exact mechanisms that worked in that. But and of course, you're seeing how people are interacting in the milieu, and so she let us lead dance groups. 

And that was the first time I remember, and this is I was in my training of Nurse... I think I was already board certified as a Nurse Coach, but still working traditional Nursing, not a specific Nursing role. And I had I was in my master's learning more about these character strengths, and so I would have dance. 

I would have groups that I would have one that would be like an expressive group where you play a song and we each have like 10 seconds, of course, with some you know some good guiding principles, no twerking, no break dancing. You know, we had to keep it clinical still too.

Nicole Vienneau  29:39

Can't can't break out in a twerk. 

Chad Sanders  29:41

Yeah, I mean, not in this setting. We're in the hospital. We gotta have to keep it. Yeah. But like, still, how do you tap into expression? Even when, and it was just powerful. It didn't matter what diagnosis it was, what the music, the power of movement. It was just it could transcend any diagnosis, and it was just, I remember, seeing the power of that. 

So we would play a song and we'd have like 15 seconds of freestyle moves, and then people would mirror you if you could. You know, of course, some people stayed seated, some people would be up, and then you'd pass it around. So that was one way, and then of course we'd have line groups, line dancing groups. But I just remember the music; it was so empowering. 

And then I was like, okay, these character strengths, and so I'd have groups on these character strengths, and then we would start introducing, okay, choose a song that represents one of these character strengths for you, and of course, songs can have multiple character strengths, and so that's a little nugget for all y'all. Once we get this, you can create your own character strength music list, and I'll get into these characters in a minute. 

But it was just I saw the power of that, and so that was the first element of okay there's some way, there's got to be some way we can blend Nursing, dancing, coaching, music, oh mindful awareness into some kind of practice, you know, and so that's really been evolving, so it started there, and it wasn't anything like specific. 

It didn't have... like it had some frame, but it was like bits and pieces here and there, and where the pieces again, all these pieces came together through years. You know, this was back in 2012, 2013, first, 2012, first so maybe 2014 or 2015, but around that time frame, leading these groups on the unit, but also as a self-care practice, I discovered this mindfulness practice called ecstatic dancing, and it was more than mindfulness. It was a more meditative practice. 

And so, basically, it was in the community, and basically you come, and there's a DJ, and the DJ creates their own playlist, right? So they have music, and the music started really light, soft, and then it would build to this high intensity, energetic music, and then come back down. And so the DJ is unique to whoever's creating the playlist. And there may be some instrumental songs or some songs with words or lyrical, different genres. But in this setting, they didn't have necessarily coaching. 

There was like opening circle, sharing guiding principles, framework of the group or that class, and then at the end there was a closing circle you could share something. But the music it was like a 90 second playlist, and you were just you didn't talk, you could make noises and sounds right. So, but you just got to be expressive and flow. 

And I just remember when I did that, I fell in love with it because mindfulness, I was always struggling, because I'm a mover. I like to move, and so like I got bored. I would, which is a good practice. It's good to notice the boredom within ourselves, right, or whatever we're noticing, mindfulness. But this was a way to really be with myself in a music setting, be with myself, but collectively. 

And I was like, This is a great practice. And so that's when, so I did that two or three times a week for years, and then that led to a discovery of dancing mindfulness, which is a training that basically was similar to ecstatic dancing, but they brought in deeper levels, and this was guided versus just the music guides itself, and it just connected you with prompts of dancing mindfulness, connecting with joy. 

But it was a wellness practice. I was like, oh, this is beautiful. And then I was like, okay, but how do we connect it with these character strengths? How do we actually incorporate coaching into it? And so that's what led, all these different modalities led to this wellness practice that I'm hoping gonna launch on Zoom starting this fall. 

So for those all around the world, or in you know America, we'll talk more about ways to connect. They'll probably start out once a month, but eventually I want to get it to a weekly practice and a drop-in wellness practice. That would be like an hour to 90 minutes. That's still evolving. You could do either, but it will… So we call it, it's a mouthful. It's Embodied Mindfulness-Based Strengths Dancing Integrative Health Coaching.

Nicole Vienneau  34:29

Say it again!

Chad Sanders  34:34

Embodied Mindfulness-Based Strengths Dancing Integrative Health Coaching.

Nicole Vienneau  34:41

Yeah!

Chad Sanders  34:42

So basically, as short you can just say, Embody your Strengths Coaching, you can call it just for short. But the reason I call it all that is because first it's a wellness practice, and we start out with mindfulness with guided awareness practices, but what grounds us first is the music, right? 

And then throughout the set, I will guide mindfulness prompts, connecting to wellness, connecting to you know setting intentions before the practice actually starts, and then throughout it, there will be and you know part of this actually stemmed, and I should have mentioned this, and you know when I first got exposed to awareness practices was my Nurse Coaching training, and I remember how powerful that was when you would coach somebody. 

And then sometimes you get stuck in the conversation, and so if you pause doing awareness practice, you go really internal, you know, and it could elicit more than sometimes words when you connect and reflect internal, and then come back to coaching the conversation. And I was like, Oh, this is basically just a movement awareness practice, you know. 

And so I would prompt health coaching questions or deeper reflections around character strengths in this practice. So the music guides the set, the coaching is invitations to reflect on, and then it follows this wave-like pattern. When it comes back down, we have a closing circle. What stood out to you about your well-being? 

So it has some framing. You know, at the beginning you set an intention for your well-being. What's present for you? Then you had the practice that could be about 30 minutes long, 30-45, and then a closing. You know, your reflection time, right? And so that's the practice in a nutshell. 

What incorporates all this, but when you hear character strengths, so some people may not be into dancing, and that's okay, or express some movement. They may not want that. That's fine. You find what works for you, right? I'm biased. I think everybody, as long as you have a heart rhythm, you have rhythm, so you might as well dance, right? 

Because if you’re sitting, then you're doing a permanent freeze, which is technically a dance move, but we were getting that. Yeah, and we don't want any V tech, I guess. But you know, we want some rhythm. We got rhythm, but the character strengths are, that's another thing I want to talk about because I'm... so the practice I created was this integrative dancing practice. That's awareness and coaching. 

But what I want to share with everybody that I want you know all Nurses to know is that to connect with your character strengths, and that's what I want to share a little background about this and ways to connect with it. And I'll first discuss, when I say character strengths, this classification this is really coming out of the field of positive psychology, and so like the beginning, like 1999, the head of the APA at the time, Marty Seligman, he challenged the profession of psychology. 

Says we know a lot about what's wrong with people, you know, empirically research which we need, how to treat that, how to diagnose. You know they need that in that area, but we know less empirically about what helps us thrive, what's best in us. Now, before then they had humanistic psychology. 

They had so they had these topics, but the science was not backing it as much. You know these themes and these you know research topics, and so the field of positive psychology has continued to evolve, but the first wave, which is really focused on what helps us thrive, what does it mean to be happy? 

There was a group of researchers, Marty Seligman and a team, and it took them about three years, and they studied Western traditions, they studied Eastern traditions, they studied religious texts, philosophical texts, and even indigenous tribes, and they came up with these universal qualities that we all have as humans. So unless you're AI, which these days we could add some AI in there, I don't know, but if you're human, we got these within us. 

So that is really the first time in history that we've had a common language for what is best in us, what helps us thrive, and that's what… that was the beauty of these strengths. And before I did my master's, I actually learned about it. It was in our book, the Nurse Coaching book, these character strengths.

Nicole Vienneau  38:52

I remember that too. 

Chad Sanders  38:54

Yeah, and so I was like, oh wow, and so, but I was still like, what do you do with them? Like, what does that mean? And so that's when I was like, okay, I went to my master's, and then even since then, taking further training in character strengths and mindfulness-based strengths practice, which is a specific program similar to… most people have heard of mindfulness-based stress reduction, which is the most popular mindfulness practice right out there. 

And this is a similar format. You mean it has eight sessions, two hours long, but it integrates mindfulness and character strengths, and it's not just to build well-being, but it's also to help manage adversity. And so it's, I love that synergy of, hey, I want to know how to handle my stress. 

Yes, that's helpful. And okay, what is best to me. How do I build off of what's there, right? These character strengths, and so basically they studied this. We had these classifications. So all of us have a unique strength profile, right? Meaning out of these 24 qualities, which another thing. Let me back up. Another benefit of these strengths, other than like strengths finder. 

Or, you know, even Myers-Briggs. This is peer-reviewed science, which brings that scientific quality and rigor to it. Even though this is evolving, so there's always, you know, they're always talking about there's always more we're learning about these strengths. So these strengths aren't meant to diagnose. They're not meant to, you know, tell you how to to live. But these are the description of the qualities that are best in us, right? And so it's beautiful with coaching, right? 

Because how do I express my humor is going to be different to how, Nicole, you express yours, right? It's uniquely express their contextual, meaning, Okay, the way I express humor here on the podcast, It's gonna be different when I'm at work versus when I'm with my family. You know, and so context matters, and it's not like a panacea. Like oh, connect. Let's just be strengths. 

Everything's gonna be good. No, these are qualities that are core to who we are. And there's times where you know we may be underusing strengths. And one of them I'll give for Nurses. You know, often one of our strengths as a profession, kindness. Right? We're caring. We're compassionate. Huge, right? Everybody says that about Nursery. We know that. 

But how many of us would underuse kindness for ourselves? At some level, potentially. I mean, it's so easy. We're caring, giving to others, but we may be underusing it for ourselves. So that's another thing. These strengths are used, the goal is to use them to benefit ourselves and others. And so there's so many layers and dimensions and qualities. 

So the official, if you want the official definition of a character strength, there are positive aspects of our personality or positive capacities within us for the ways that we think, the ways that we feel, the ways that we behave, that benefit ourselves and others. So it's not just okay how am I using my strength? No. How do I use it in my thinking? How do I use hope in my thinking or humor in my thinking? 

How do I connect with humor in my body? Where do I feel that when I really feel that that belly laugh with a colleague, or the humor that you get interacting with a patient that kind of helps them take a turn for the best, you know, or helps them persevere through the hospitalization, or how do I use humor in my actions, right? So we can use all of these in our thinking, feeling, and behaving, but also, hey, is this benefiting myself only, or just benefiting that other person only? 

No. How do I balance that expression? So, again, you can learn about them, but it's really about practicing them, living them. Same with mindfulness. We learn about this, but it's okay how am I present with myself? And yes, it could be a formal meditation practice, but just moment to moment, how do I recognize, catch that autopilot to bring me back to the moment? 

You know, whether I'm in coaching conversation or whether I'm with a patient or with my family or you know anywhere, and so the synergy of these mindfulness and character strengths is just beautiful. They're separate but deeply interconnected. It's like a tree, and this was a visual from some of the training. The branches were like these character strengths, but the roots were mindfulness. 

You know the qualities of mindfulness, and so I want to do a little practice just to share. You know because I'm sharing a bunch about these character strengths because there's layers to it. It's hard to really... It's not just you know when you say you're strength focused, what does that mean? You know, a lot of us as coaches we're strength focused, but you know exactly what does that mean? 

Because we have other strengths, we have skills like Nursing skills, coaching skills. Those are strengths, but that's different than character strengths. We need those. We have talents, right? Nicole, you're a talented podcast host and coach, right? That may be natural, or someone can be naturally talented at you know exercise, movement, or you know mathematically, you know, or musically, right? 

You could have these talents, of course, resources, right? And then we have our values, which these strengths actually they're called VIA character strengths, and VIA means several different things. But VIA is the VIA Institute on Character, which is the nonprofit that studies these character strengths, and it's a great resource we can plug and share and you know in the the notes of the podcast. 

And then there's the VIA classification, right? The survey, and then there's a VIA survey. So the VIA classification is the classification of character strengths and virtues, and then there's a survey that is a validated survey that will list out your strength profile. So that's what my vision is. I believe every Nurse, really, all I'm biased. I'm gonna start with Nurses, but really all healthcare professionals, all humans, if you want to think about it in reality. 

But we'll start with just healthcare Nurses in healthcare to have to know these strengths, right? To know who they are, right? And I, because like I said, I wish I could say they would fix everything, and they can't. But it's going to help you. I mean, and how do you connect with who you are at your best at work? How do you help? 

How do you connect with those strengths when you're dealing with challenges? Right, they're so empowering, and there are pathways, and there are tools or resources, lenses to look through. And so I just I believe all Nurses, I want all Nurses to know their character strengths. Again, there's so many layers, and so I'm trying to give a snapshot of them. 

But really, they're lifelong, and it's about practicing them. And no, there's no perfect strength expression. There's no... even with mindfulness, nobody's fully present all the time. Even the best gurus in mindfulness, right? Our minds wander; it's autopilot, you know. So it's always about how do we catch that return to the present, you know, and then we can return to our character strengths. 

How do we call forth, you know, what strengths are needed for this situation, or this context? And so, basically, we all have a strength profile, though. And if you go to their website, you can take a free validated survey that will list out your strength profile, and we all have signature strengths, middle strengths, and lesser strengths. And what that means is the signature strengths are those qualities that feel just essential to who we are. 

They feel core to us. They're part of our identity. They contribute to the collective good. They benefit ourselves and others. But they're essential. They're effortless. They're energizing. That's what they call the 3 e's of a signature strength. So if you don't take the survey, which you don't have to, if you look at the classification, which you can find the classification on the website, we can even put in the podcast. It's free research. 

Nicole Vienneau  46:37

Yeah, we'll definitely share the link to the VIA survey, the VIA character strengths survey in the show notes. So if you are interested as you're listening to this after you listen to it all, then go back and check it out. Well, the thing that came up for me as you were talking about the strengths is that many times we don't live from our strengths, or we don't know. We can't pinpoint or call them what they are.

Chad Sanders  47:07

Yes.

Nicole Vienneau  47:08

And once we understand, or once we get a name for something, I think that's helpful.

Chad Sanders  47:16

Yeah.

Nicole Vienneau  47:16

For me, it's been helpful. But and the other thing is that you mentioned about practicing it, because I have done this survey, the VIA, but I did it when I took the Nurse Coaching program, which was in 2013, and I haven't done it again since then.

Chad Sanders  47:34

Yeah.

Nicole Vienneau  47:35

And Chad has sent me the list of all of the virtues, the strength virtues, and which we can also share in the… well, I don't know if we can share that, but we'll share the link. Yeah, we'll share the link. 

Chad Sanders  47:51

I think it's a free downloadable file on their website, so you could...

Nicole Vienneau  47:54

Oh, good. So I could share that link.

Chad Sanders  47:56

Yeah.

Nicole Vienneau  47:57

Awesome. Because it was really interesting, even in just a short time, to look at that list, and I know he's going to ask me to do something here. 

Chad Sanders  48:05

Yes, a live experiment today. 

Nicole Vienneau  48:08

Okay, so here we go. We're going to do that part now.

Chad Sanders  48:11

So this is a practice that I invite any of y'all to do, and you can maybe even do it... Don't do it while you're driving. We don't practice mindfulness while you're… well, you can be mindfully present, but don't close your eyes. You know, stay focused on it. But you can, if you listen to this, maybe you can go back, and what you would have to do is choose for this practice, and really you can choose any of these character strengths. 

But I want you to choose one. Either if you took that survey, choose one of your top five. If you didn't take the survey, as you're looking at that list, choose one, and you have more than one. We have an average 5.5, but of  those strengths that feel essential to who you are, that's probably the number one question you could ask yourself. Even if you take the survey, right? 

Because a survey is a tool, and it is evidence based. It's validated, but it's still it's not perfect. Meaning, you still want to, you know, be curious about your own response to the survey. There's no right response. But if you didn't take it, ask yourself, hey, is that really essential to who I am? 

You know, even before I was a Nurse, during Nursing school, in my Nurse Coaching, in my burnout, in my thriving, is it a part of my life in all different contexts, right? Just essential to who you are, and then two other questions that connect with that quality of a signature strength: Is it effortless? 

Does it kind of just flow out of me? Is it natural part of who I am? And then the third one could be: Is it energizing? When I'm connected with that quality, does it bring me some kind of energy? So that's what they, you know, some of the research and some of the trends, they call it the 3 e's of a signature strength: essential, energizing, effortless. 

But the number one question I would say is it essential to you? Core, right? And so I asked Nicole on the spot and just reflect. We're going to do a little awareness practice, and this is where if you all choose one, you can do it along with us later. If you listen to this, but choose one that you want to reflect on that just feels essential to you, and you're not going to tell me what that is yet. But we're going to do a little guided mindful awareness practice. 

So first, just connect into the present moment, our breath, and then I'll ask you some reflective questions. Do not need to respond out loud to me, just internally about this character strength, and then I'm going to have another angle of questions, and then at the end, all I want you to do is give me your gut response. It could be a word, a sentence, for what this practice was like for you. 

So take a moment, Nicole. We're in the middle of a podcast, but we're going to let go of technology stressors, letting go of what we got to do after this podcast, what we did before it, and just taking a moment to connect with this moment, and maybe that's starting with our breath. Not trying to judge it, just witnessing that breath coming in, and then breath coming out. 

Take your time. Breath is always with us since the moment we've been alive. Just coming in and out, and now just inviting that curiosity to your breath. Maybe it's noticing the coolness as the air comes in, and warmness as it comes out. Maybe it's through your nose or mouth, or maybe it's something different. Just observing and witnessing. And when your mind wanders, that's normal. 

That's what our minds do. It's okay to acknowledge and then allow your attention to come back to your breathing. And now, Nicole, I invite you to shift for a moment and just call forth that strength that you chose-one of those 24 that are within you that feels essential to who you are. 

And just take a moment and really honoring this one quality within you-the one of many-but this one quality-and take it a moment reflecting how this quality has helped you in your Nurse Coaching podcast today, how it's helped you in your career through both the joys and pains of your career, how it's helped in personal relationships with yourself, with others. 

Maybe how it's helped you meet goals and achieve things, and also how it's helped you overcome adversity through your life. Just taking a moment, really honoring this one quality, how it's been a part of you, in many dimensions and capacities and expressions, and just feel that within you as a living quality. 

And now I'm going to invite you to shift again and imagine that for one month, just one month, that strength is plucked out of you. Boop, right on out, and you can't use that strength at all for just one month. Imagine not being... maybe the strength was kindness, not being able to be kind to yourself or others, or maybe that strength was social intelligence, not being aware of the motives or feelings within yourself, within your surroundings, and others, or maybe that was the strength of perseverance. 

Hey, just I know I can't persevere on things right now. Things get tough. I just can't tap into that quality. Or maybe it was the strength of leadership, right, just kind of following, not helping organizing groups to get things done. Or maybe that was the strength of honesty. Can't tap into your authentic self. 

Silent when you need to speak. Speak, but not from authenticity. Just imagine whatever strength that was you chose, not being able to use that just for a month. Well, the good news is that strength is very much within you as we speak, but as I invite us back from this internal mindfulness reflective practice, I'm going to invite you to open your eyes, and I just want you to share, Nicole, as we come back, one word or a sentence that you felt when you imagined not being able to tap into that quality you chose for a month. What did that feel like for you? A word or...

Nicole Vienneau  55:51

Yeah, I thought: what??

Chad Sanders  55:53

Yeah, like what the heck? Hold on. This is not reality. That can't be true, right? No, and that so this is like a real visceral practice. First time I did this, I chose zest. That was a strength, and that's one of my qualities: zest, humor, spirituality, fairness. Those are some of my top ones. And I was like, man, I'm bored. This sucks. Like I can't feel energy? 

Like I can't connect with what? No, and so it's a real visceral practice to imagine, and it's supposed to boost our well-being. It's called a mental subtraction activity, right? Imagine something not being there, but also it's a way to really tap in because you can learn about these strengths. 

You can say, okay, these are my top, but what does that mean? And it's a real visceral just to be like, okay, no, how has that quality really been a part of my life, even in this moment, right? And you can technically do this with any of them, right? 

Even the last one, because the last one on your profile is not a weakness, and all of these strengths really matter, because you chose one, but Nicole, I'm sure you could reflect on like we don't use these in isolation, meaning we use them in combinations and dimensions, and so there's many layers to this, but I hope that felt real. You could tap into that quality within you.

Nicole Vienneau  57:08

Oh yeah, definitely, definitely.

Chad Sanders  57:12

So for those who listen along, feel free to try that as you choose one of your strengths and reflect on that. You kind of know what's happening now, but you know, that's okay.

Nicole Vienneau  57:22

It is okay because as you do something again, it becomes easier, I think, and then you feel okay, this is what it could be, and now I'm going to learn something different. I'm going to try it again.

Chad Sanders  57:36

Yeah. And you bring up a good point because even the top ones, sometimes we can resonate because we all have strength blindness, right? Where we may not recognize, and that's building awareness. That's why the beauty of mindfulness and character strength is so essential, I think, and powerful synergy, but also we could take strengths for granted, you know. 

And even think about, you know, you think about a patient, or I'm thinking, you know, if I'm been in a hospital, you see some patients, and you can recognize these qualities, right? You see their perseverance, or you see the humor in the midst of their challenges, right? So it doesn't fix things necessarily, but it taps into their course. 

So there's a whole practice called strength spotting, and think about too the patient that expresses gratitude to us, we feel good when they appreciate the work we're doing. I don't know about y'all, I always felt great when that was authentically expressed, right? 

And that's just one of the 24, gratitude. So strength spotting is when you name, you see a strength, and so you can do this with patients, you can do this in coaching conversations. You can do this with yourself, your partner. But when you spot the strength that you see, you express how you noticed it and express appreciation for it, right? So, and it can just be a powerful you know relationship builder, right? Professionally or personally.

Nicole Vienneau  58:53

I thought of it as a useful tool for those patients, those people in our lives where we're like, oh my gosh, like, ooh, I have a rub with that person, or oh my gosh, they're ugh, and then trying to find something, a strength, to spot that strength can help us maybe shift our relationship a little bit, or help that interaction.

Chad Sanders  59:16

Well, you're using your strength naming that- strength of perspective, you know, but also bravery sometimes to do that, like honestly. But also, there's a topic. There is a topic in the strength language called strength collisions, and there can be some. For instance, I'm high in zest and humor, right? 

So that comes across playful sometimes, and then somebody else may be really high in prudence, and they may seem that doesn't seem very prudent to express humor like that, right? So there is subjectivity, but there could be some play because somebody may really be coming naturally with that, and the other person too. So it does, it's a powerful, what you said is very powerful. It pauses. 

Okay, it's a lens to look through. There are qualities within all of us. Now there are, I want to give a caveat because it's how we express them because there's a whole language, and we could share this. There's a free tool on their website as well for the overuse and underuse of strengths. 

Because sometimes you can be overusing a strength and it's not helping, or underusing it, or even misusing it, right? And so think about someone that does spam emails. They're very creative. They're using their strength of creativity, right? Technically, but they're misusing it, right? I would say. And so these aren't meant to diagnose. I'm not….There is some subjectivity, but there are layers there, and so it invites that natural curiosity, right?

Nicole Vienneau  1:00:36

Yeah. So when we think about your... this program that you're going to be launching...

Chad Sanders  1:00:42

Yes.

Nicole Vienneau  1:00:43

How would the strengths kind of fit into that?

Chad Sanders  1:00:47

Yeah. So I want to say two domains that I'm doing. One is my personal, what I created, the combination of all these different modalities into one wellness practice. That's the embodied strengths coaching or the long title. We'll put it there later. But the Embodied Mindfulness-Based Strengths Dancing. So that's one avenue. 

Another avenue, which is not mine. I studied, and again, I'm not representative of VIA, I love them because it's incredible nonprofit organization. But I did take a training to get certified to facilitate mindfulness-based strengths practice, which is a specific program that's designed to integrate mindfulness and character strengths.

Nicole Vienneau  1:01:11

Oh, wonderful!

Chad Sanders  1:01:20

So, it follows like an eight-week cycle, two-hour sessions, and so it is a great way, evidence-based research is done with this, and is actually shown to have sometimes some better results than even mindfulness-based stress reduction. Not saying that this is… it's not about competition. It's finding what works, but the beauty of this, it's helping manage adversity and to build well-being. Right. 

That's the design of the program in the eight-week cycle. And I'll share two ways that they integrate, and then I'll share how it's connected to our wellness practice. So the two ways really to integrate these is one you can think of mindful strength use or strong mindfulness, which are two pathways to connect. 

And strong mindfulness can be using character strengths to help with a meditation practice or mindfulness practice. Because I don't know about y'all, but some of us it could be our mind wandering, or it could be the busyness that we have, or we just forget to practice, right? And so you can tap into... So what strength did you choose, Nicole? 

Nicole Vienneau  1:02:33

Curiosity.

Chad Sanders  1:02:35

Curiosity. You can think, how can I tap into my curiosity with my mindfulness practice? So it's a way to help you energize, stay committed to your practice, and you could do whatever your top strengths are, or any of them. The other one is mindful strength use, meaning bringing mindfulness to character strengths, and that could be character strength expression, right? 

It could be, you know, so it's basically to integrate them in daily life, right? That's the goal. Mindful strength used or character strength used expression, or strong mindfulness using those character strengths to energize our practices. And so, there's a specific program, you can take it through the VIA website. I'm trained. 

I'm trying to... I'm in the process of getting it, applying to get it approved for Nursing continuing education hours, which is still work in progress, and I'm trying to partner with Karen. I haven't applied yet, but hopefully, maybe next year, if possible, it's still not guaranteed, to try to offer it to Nurse coaches through the INCA platform. 

Hopefully, there'll be some partnership. Throwing that out there, Karen, but I'm applying, but no, applying because I want to offer this to Nurses, and so I'm applying through you know to get Nursing continuing education credit anyway. 

But you can take this through VIA, which is incredible, and I think they give... they don't have Nursing Continuing Eds, but I'm sure you could use, you could share that you did this program and get credit or share it with your board, or I think it does give you coaching, like ICF coaching credit hours.

Nicole Vienneau  1:04:04

Oh yeah, and we all need those coaching credit hours.

Chad Sanders  1:04:06

Yeah, so I think you get some, but it's not… I want it specific for Nurses. I want Nurses to be able to get continuing education for their well-being. That's what I want.

Nicole Vienneau  1:04:14

Yeah, yeah.

Chad Sanders  1:04:16

But the ways that you integrate it with the dancing practice is really so, again, and maybe we'll do a sample live. We have to get permission because people would be moving on camera. They may not want that recording. That's fine. But basically, you would want some background of these character strengths. 

But usually, there's a primer worksheet that we have because this practice includes mindfulness, includes meditation, it could be journaling. It's health coaching. So, you show up the first 15 minutes. If you're brand new to this practice, we would explain it, what you expect. Because in this practice, movement, I mean, silence or stillness is considered dance, and it's very expressive. 

So the music and the energy of the group does elicit us sometimes to move more or up or down, but you also honoring your own body's limitations, your own needs, where you're at, so you can stay still the whole time if you wanted to, and that's welcome in this practice. 

But the first piece is guiding principles of the practice. Then we invite you to choose a character strength you want to bring forth in the practice. So you kind of set an intention. Hey, I want to invite this into this meditative movement practice, and then throughout the set, I will facilitate coaching questions and movement dialog that are invitations, right? 

Not mandatory. Maybe you don't like that question. You let it go, and then there's a different question asked, but deeper the ways to connect with that strength, or how do you express that strength in a moment? Where do you feel the strength in the song? Where do you feel it in your body? And then at the end, any insights that come to you, and we tie it into wellness goals that you may be working on.

Nicole Vienneau  1:05:51

Love this. So this is like a new avenue for group coaching.

Chad Sanders  1:05:55

Yeah, it's kind of like... it's not yoga, but you think about some people love yoga practices. Some people just like meditation. This is a movement meditative coaching practice, right? Wellness practice.

Nicole Vienneau  1:06:06

Well, and so many times, well, I love group coaching. That's one of my loves, my true loves, and I do a 

lot of group coaching styles, and so I really enjoy this style. It's incorporating many different things, and not saying that what I'm going to say is bad at the moment. But like, if I go to a yoga practice, I'm going to be just by myself. I'm going to be with everybody. 

But I'm by myself. I don't get to share what I learn about myself in a yoga practice because a yoga class, because I'm just going to go home after, and then I have that internal process, you know, that internal learning. And what I love about group coaching is that I could potentially share what I learned about myself in this dance-based mindfulness practice with someone else. 

They hear my voice, they see me, and then I'm going to learn more from that. As well as when I share, someone else sees me, hears me, and like, ooh, I hadn't thought about that. I really connect with that, or whatever that is, and then that in turn helps everyone.

Chad Sanders  1:07:18

Yeah, no, you named it-the power of group. We know so many different dimensions, and coaching, group coaching has powerful dimensions. And what you said is there would be some elements of that personal yoga feel, meaning in the dance, you dance, but then before and after is when there's coaching that happens during the practice, but at the end is that group coaching, the typical talk. 

And part of this practice too is like, I don't know about y'all, but when you've been coached, or even when you're coaching, sometimes you feel stuck in the conversation. You can't fully name it, and so you need to express it. And so this is a way, right? And I found that in awareness practices originally, like going internal, just inviting. Hey, what's present right now? 

And so, but this goes to presence within your whole body, your movement, your expression, and it's just its power. Plus, it's playful. It has so many different other elements, and it can even lead into flow. That's not the goal of that. Just like mindfulness, the goal isn't necessarily relaxing. 

That's more of a byproduct. Sometimes when you do, when you're mindfulness, you may notice, Hey, I'm feeling stress right now. That's being mindful, right? You may also feel, hey, these breaths are helping me feel relaxed. So it's more of a byproduct. Same with the flow state. This is, you can lead into flow, and you just in the moment jamming and playfulness and right? But it's about coming back to what's present, you know.

Nicole Vienneau  1:08:35

Yeah, yeah. Well, awesome. So we'll be looking forward to hearing more about your process...

Chad Sanders  1:08:42

Yeah, hopefully we'll launch in... we'll be on Zoom like we're doing here, and of course the in person, they have different dynamics but it's a powerful practice and I want to share it and it's just one way, it's another way to connect with these character strengths and well being for ourselves.

Nicole Vienneau  1:08:58

Right and that brings me to just the realization and the understanding that so you graduated from your Nurse Coaching program 2015, I from 2013, and how much my own practice, my own person, my personal self has shifted and evolved, and I think this is a lesson for our Nurses who have been practicing as Nurse coaches for a long time to understand, or those who are newer too. 

You're going to evolve. You're going to pull aspects of things that really connect with you on a personal level, to pull into your practice as a Nurse Coach, as a human, and then that evolves into maybe bringing it forward in a program that you didn't even dream of, you know, 20 years, 13 years ago, and all of a sudden this comes to fruition, and here you are. You know, graduating 2015, it is now 2026, I mean, what's that? 11 years ago. You knew you wanted to do something, what did that look like?

Chad Sanders  1:10:11

It's evolving.

Nicole Vienneau  1:10:11

And then it evolves, right? 

Chad Sanders  1:10:14

That's the beauty. I love how you said that for Nursing and coaching because Nursing, there's lots we evolve in our career. Same with even though it's the same, coaching, oh, I was like, yeah, I'm just gonna coach traditional, which I'd still do, but I was like, wait, there's something else that's calling forth within me.

Nicole Vienneau  1:10:31

Yeah.

Chad Sanders  1:10:31

And I didn't know how to name it. I didn't know fully, but then life, you embrace what's your life experiences, right?

Nicole Vienneau  1:10:38

Yes.

Chad Sanders  1:10:38

And then you create your niche or your niche, and that can even evolve, you know.

Nicole Vienneau  1:10:44

It kind of reminds me of where we started at the beginning of this conversation with you pulling in all your medals from you being a kid, and now here you are, like, okay, let's take this, and I learned this, and I really connected with this. I want to learn more about that, and or I know this already, so I can incorporate that into my practice as a Nurse Coach or as a Nurse as a human. So, okay, this is so good. We could talk about this all day, but we can't. 

Chad Sanders  1:11:10

We see your strength of self regulation and leadership, right? You did a great podcast host and leader.

Nicole Vienneau  1:11:19

So we love to close out or slowly close out our podcast with one question, and the question is, you can take a moment to just really dive in:What is on your heart that you would like to share with our listeners?

Chad Sanders  1:11:46

Well, of course, it's got to come back to my heart is beating, which means I have rhythm, which means all of y'all have rhythm, right? But really, it's about being authentic, right? And that being authentic to who you are as a human first, right? That even led you into Nursing, that led you into coaching, but also your passions, your joys, your strengths. So really, just tap into who you are, right? 

And in embodying that in whatever practice you have, whether it's entrepreneurial, in the hospital, maybe you even leave Nursing. I hope not, but then you still bring in who you are. That Nurse, you know, you're always a Nurse internally, but your authentic self, your character strength. So I just... brace your authenticity, right, and your uniqueness that we need in this world, in coaching domain, Nursing domain, and in the world itself. So that's yeah, that's on my heart. But really, it's beating. I just want to...

Nicole Vienneau  1:12:51

For listeners, you can't see Chad, but he's got his… he's got shoulder rolls, chest rolls going on.

Chad Sanders  1:12:58

But if you come to this class or this group wellness party, maybe you don't feel like moving your shoulders. That's fine. And breathing is dancing. That's movement. Cellularly, we're moving. So it's authentic expression, right? And so, yes, come as you are, move as you are.

Nicole Vienneau  1:13:16

Beautiful, beautiful reminder. Yes, our hearts are beating. We already have rhythm. We're good to go. 

Chad Sanders  1:13:22

Yeah, and cats are welcome in this practice. 

Nicole Vienneau  1:13:24

Cats are welcome. Yeah, dogs, cats. We always have our furry friends. Well, Chad, this has been such a wonderful, wonderful conversation, full of many different possibilities for us as humans, our listeners, our Nurses, our families-you know-thank you so much for sharing your time with us today.

Chad Sanders  1:13:47

Yeah, one more thing before we leave. I know, I keep going. Is that because the age of AI is exciting but also scary, and these strengths are human qualities. So we need it more than ever, right, to tap into our humanness, even as we dive into technology or you know whatever. So I just yes, these strengths. I just... connect with those strengths. They're there.

Nicole Vienneau  1:14:10

Connect with the strengths. Hey, and listeners, we'll be sure to add Chad's contact information in our show notes and how you can follow him. Chad, are you on social media?

Chad Sanders  1:14:22

Yeah, you can find me on LinkedIn. You can find me on- personal, not as much coaching, but there's some elements of it- on Instagram. But LinkedIn is probably professionally the best way. Website: ConnectWellness.net. Got a professional email. But maybe I'll too, I'll share a primer for this embodied dancing practice that you can see if you come to this. This is kind of a worksheet that can help you process what this could look like. And then a takeaway too is if you take those strengths... another takeaway, I got lots...

Nicole Vienneau  1:14:47

We might be here all day.

Chad Sanders  1:14:54

So choose one of your strengths and then create your own strength playlist. Meaning your... or your strength curiosity. Think about what strengths really elicit that curiosity for you. I mean, what songs, and it could be lyrical, instrumental, and so you can create a whole personal playlist for your strengths.

Nicole Vienneau  1:15:14

I love that.

Chad Sanders  1:15:14

Another powerful way.

Nicole Vienneau  1:15:15

Yeah, it doesn't have to just be a theme song. It could be a playlist of all of them to make me help me reconnect and enhance that curiosity. Yeah, strength. Well, perfect. Well, thanks again!

Chad Sanders  1:15:30

All right, thanks! This was fun! Strengths with y'all later!

Nicole Vienneau  1:15:35

Strengths with y’all!